r u kidding me?

r u kidding me?

Wednesday, February 5, 2014

Downton Abbey Discussion Episode 6

*If you have not watched the most recent episode (6) last Sunday (and perhaps you have not with the Superbowl and all) this is a discussion of that program. Please skedaddle while the skedaddling is good! My local PBS station calls this episode #5 because they lump the first two shown together as #1. That is incorrect and probably is a ruse to fool us all. I don't know. All I know is that everywhere else, including the UK, this one is known as Episode 6.*


This was the episode where we learn that Edith is pregnant her symptoms being consistent with the first trimester of pregnancy. 


Yup. We all saw that coming. She does not tell her parents, even when they are both quite tender with her. 

Edited to Add: Kristi brought up an interesting point in comments. What do you think? By design or by accident? 

~Edith and Sir Anthony Strallan on left and Michael Gregson on right~

I particularly liked the scene between Robert and Edith in front of the fire. He tells her that he loves all his children equally and she responds that she does not know why parents say that when it is, of course, not true. 

How do you feel about that? Do all parents love their children equally? Personally, I do not think it is humanly possible to do. I do think it is nearly possible for a parent to treat both children equally, but to love both equally? Nope. I'm with you, Edith.

Robert's birthday is coming up and Rose and Cora are planning it together except that Rose has an extra surprise that she keeps secret even from Cora with Mrs. Hughes's help. That surprise is the handsome Jack Ross who arrives with five band members and a good deal of enthusiasm both for the job and Lady Rose. 

(Baxter  had reported to Barrow what she had overheard about Lady Rose and Mrs. Hughes keeping a secret. She seemed reluctant to do so, though.)

I really enjoyed the discussion between Jack and Carson. Jack handled Carson's question about visiting Africa with geniality and skill saying that his family had been in England since the 1700s. 

Robert and Cora both embraced the Jazz evening. Violet's response to Evelyn's (Evelyn?!)  question about  liking jazz was so funny. She wondered if the band knew what the others [also in the band] were playing. And I liked how Cora told Robert (who was fretting over her brother Harold) to "Come to bed and dream of Ragtime."

The story with Peg was resolved with a good deal of banter between Isobel and Violet. Peg's story is really just a throwaway from what I can tell...didn't go anywhere in particular other than to give the characters something to do and the discussion back and forth. We do learn that Isobel can be a great snoop. Dr. Clarkson actually defended Lady Grantham this week saying that she won the argument between herself and Isobel.

Mary has two likely suitors show up in Charles Blake and Evelyn Napier (Right. His name is Evelyn. Apparently,  Evelyn used to be a masculine name. Girls were not named Evelyn until the 1880s.)

 Evelyn is an old friend of Mary's going back to Season 1. Quite frankly, I had forgotten him. Charles is a Socialist. Evelyn and Charles are staying at Downton while they do some research on why the large estates are failing. Mary would like information about that in exchange for the hospitality, but she is unlikely to get it because Charles is nearly insufferable. He has, however, met his match in Mary who can be pretty insufferable herself. So now we have three possible suitors for Mary: Mr. Gillingham, Mr. Napier, and Mr. Blake. Whom do you prefer? I'm taking bets. ☺

Loved the fact that Mrs. Hughes and Mrs. Patmore worked together to get Moseley back on board for Alfred is off to London to study as a chef after all. Poor Daisy! I had hoped that the two of them would get together. Sigh.

My favorite scene of the week? Perhaps yours, too? Back to the nursery with Tom, Isobel, and Mary who share what it was like to have known love. At the end, Isobel leans back in her chair, totally relaxed and smiling and says, "Aren't we the lucky ones?" 

True. So true. True love is never wasted.

Now I have saved some major story lines for you to discuss. Need a hint? 



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38 comments:

  1. The scene in the nursery brought tears to my eyes. To be sharing your memories of true love is touching and we all need to remember to cherish good memories. My favorite scene though? When they are all still in the dining room and Rose runs in to tell the band to start.....and they enter the party and start dancing. Oh, I loved it ALL! It makes me want to learn to dance ragtime! It was a wonderful show (and we watched it again last night) Thanks for the fun, Vee! PS The restaurant scene? PRICELESS! Cora is a true lady with grace and dignity. BRAVO as Isobel would say!!!

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  2. I have been waiting for season 5 since last year lol ! Have a good day !

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  3. I did not watch it, however, I plan to read on it. lol--Thanks Vee, I had forgotten all about reading up on it.. Blessings

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  4. Okay, so much to discuss here! First of all, I don't know that it's humanly impossible to love all our children equally. But I do think that Robert was very tender toward Edith and Edith rebuffed him because she has continually chosen to see herself as a victim. I'm a little tired of her unjust attitude. I did like the exchange between Isobel and the Dowager Countess. It was good for Isobel to see that she isn't the world's only caring, forgiving person (who, by the way, also harbored her own smug, superior attitude toward the family - which she personally accused them of having.) I thought it was a great lesson! Then, as far as Mary's suitors go, I am hoping, HOPING that Season Five brings Branson and Mary together. It just makes so much sense - although Mary may opt for the financial security of either Gillingham or Blake. I think Napier is out of the running. I think EEvelyn, like the name LeVerne and several others, used to be men's or women's names. Even now, I know a man named Courtney and a woman named Courtney. Interesting, isn't that!

    Julian Fellowes never lets me down. I think if they ever switch writers for this series, it will die. He is amazing!

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  5. I don't like either of the "likely suitors" for Mary...they will never compare to Matthew and that's what she will wait for, although she has a very sexual side and may have many encounters before she finds that one special guy. I think Rose's story-lines are a throw away; I wouldn't mind seeing her go off to America with Jack Ross and live happily ever! However, I think it will be Edith who travels to America to avoid the shame to her parents and live with Martha (Cora's mother). I just hope we don't have Mr. Bates heading to jail again for strangling Mr. Green...who by the way, deserves no less, but not at the expense of losing another character as loved as Mr. Bates. I just adore how tender he treats his dear Anna and tries to convince her that nothing she's done deserves that! Hooray for being a gentleman. And, what about Cora putting that snobby matre'd in his place! Sometimes she is too docile for my liking, but then, well, it was surprising. Oh my, could I go on and on...XOXO

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  6. I just started watching Downton Abbey two weeks ago, so I am still trying to keep up with the character names. As a former soap follower, I am not having as much difficulty as I thought I would. My question is: why do we Americans get so caught up in these British shows (and real life, too) of aristocracy? Linda@Wetcreek Blog

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  7. Out of the 3 suitors this season so far, Gillingham, Blake and Evelyn, I like Evelyn the best. I liked him since season 1 when Mary overlooked him for the Turkish guy. I like Gillingham the least. Even with all 3, none of them can compare to the chemistry of Mary and Matthew. I hope she doesn't settle.

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    1. Out of the three, I, too, like Evelyn the best. I think far too many women overlook friends in favor of excitement.

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  8. I wonder what poor Edith will do??? I loved the scene in the restaurant...I have never loved Lady Grantham more than I did in this scene. I have a feeling Lord Gillingham will be back around, with his evil man servant. This will surely make more conflict for the Bates. I also was touched by Robert's tenderness towards Edith. Mary is the one who treats her poor sis badly...I don't remember seeing Sybil ever being mean to her either.

    Have a great Wednesday! :)

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  9. Do mothers love their children equally? Mothers love all of their children but they love the one that needs them most in a more profound way. This might seem to a sibling that the other is more loved. Not so, they just need their parent more.

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  10. I saved this episode until last evening , as Super Bowl and all that excitement took my Sunday evening. Oh, what an episode! Loved so many aspects of the show .. the staff's reaction to having a black man amongst them ... what a little window on race relations and how graceful was that exchange between Jack Ross and Mr Carson ? Wasn't the restaurant scene super also? It was wonderful to see Lady Cora step up and show social savvy with that snobby maitre'd and doubly nice to see Anna and Bates begin to loosen up a bit. I do feel, though, that the trauma of Anna's experience is souring her character's potential for further development. Edith ... poor Edith. Her situation brings me to a question ... what year are we talking here? What's going on in Munich that might be dangerous for Edith's lover? Need to research a bit there. Edith's exchanges with her parents was touching and a bit frustrating, as she continually pitches herself as the poor follow-up to Mary and the cast-side from beloved baby sister Sybil. Get over it girl and be yourself! There's plenty there to love and admire if she'd just stop with the 'pitiful me thing' ! Love all my kids equally ... no way. They are all individuals and I love them differently ... unconditionally, but differently as their needs and foibles dictate. There is 'mother love' ... that unconditional primal love and there's 'parental love' ... the love and concern that you give to your child that guides them along. Does that make sense? Anyway ... what a rich episode!

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  11. Seeing it all written out here makes me realize how very much is packed into each episode!
    My favorite scene was the scene in the nursery as Isobel, Tom, and Mary spoke of love.
    I agree with Cranberry Morning...I am tired of Edith's "poor little me" demeanor. Much of her troubles are of her own doing.
    I do think it's possible to love one's children equally! Of course, each one is an individual and has his/her own personality, so each parent/child relationship is also unique. But to me, unique or different is not the same as unequal. I cannot imagine loving one of my four more than the others.

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    1. I just had to say how perfectly Cheryl answered the question of loving our children equally. I have four sons and I agree...."I cannot imagine loving one of my four more than the others." Well said! I totally agree!

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    2. I totally agree with you as well, Diane & Cheryl. My two grown sons are as different as night and day...you would never know they had the same parents! The younger one has made great choices and is very successful...the other, unfortunately, bad choices have resulted in many tough issues and a hard life. I love my boys equally, yet I love them uniquely...one's needs are totally different than the other's as well as the prayers I pray for them are.

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  12. It was a good episode, filled with all kinds of nuggets. I especially liked quote about being the lucky ones. Yes, indeed! And I do like how Cora came to the rescue at the restaurant.

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  13. Oh yes, I forgot about your question about parents loving their children, whether equally or not. Since I was never a parent, I can't say from a direct perspective. But I do know that my parents made it quite clear who their favorites were over the years. That's not to say that all parents should be painted with the same brush. I am a firm believer that the quality of love that one shows is a reflection of the person. Generalities don't fit everyone, by definition.

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  14. I am with you Vee.....that was the best scene ever......I adore Isobel.....that seemed to me, finally revealed Mary's heart...thinking of her Matthew....all three were just wonderful in the nursery.....what a gift this show has been to so many!

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  15. The Language of Love is different for each person, likewise each child. I would suspect that the usual dense Robert never figured out what Edith's love language was and so his attempts to love her "equally" meant that she didn't feel loved at all. I would advise any child that felt they were not loved in equal measure with their siblings to consider if there was a mis-match in language between parent and child.

    I also want to give a look at the scene between Cora and Anna where Cora tells Anna to chose an outfit for Cora to wear to an event. I know that in the 1910-1920 aristocrats changed clothing at least five times a day and each change took almost an hour to complete with assistance. The clothing were designed so it was almost impossible to change the clothes without assistance. During the re-enactment of life in 1910 the people involved in the project complained bitterly about having to give up five to six hours a day to stand and be dressed for breakfast, outings, dinner etc. Deciding which outfit definitely loses its charm when one is forced to decide again every two to three hours. Cora is happy reading a book and clearly would have liked to stay home but was meeting her societal/charitable obligations but was "over" making sure she was making a fashion statement. BTW...the marcelle hair style that is being worn in this era also took hours to create. I get a kick out of seeing year books from that era and seeing that all the girls took the time to have perfect waves that would be ruined at the first gust of wind!

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    1. Wow...thanks for all of the great information AND insight...it's all very interesting. I am just so glad I wasn't born into aristocracy. I have always been overly modest...even as a little girl...and I don't want NOBODY dressing me...lol!

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  16. I truly believe I love each of my children with all my heart. But I can see that I like them a bit differently, and not always the same difference. I try not to show this, without being dishonest .
    I am enjoying this season of Downton. I did not expect to! Poor Edith. And what has happened to her beloved. I hope he has not run afoul of the Nazis. I hope he has not become a Nazi.... I hope he and Edith never move to Germany.....A tragic instance of this, with slightly different timing, is in D.E. Stevenson's book The English Air. It was reviewed here http://leavesandpages.com/2014/01/25/the-english-air-by-d-e-stevenson/

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    1. Kristi...you are exactly right...equal in love but don't always like them the same!

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  17. Thanks Vee, I've enjoyed reading the comments and your thoughts. The nursery scene with those who had loved and lost was very touching. Good comment about Robert not knowing Edith's love language. Something for us all to ponder about our own loved ones.

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  18. It was a wonderful episode! I loved Cora at the restaurant. It was just the perfect way to put that person back in HIS place. The Nursery scene was charming. It was truly warm and what a wonderful exchange they had.
    I think we love our children unconditionally. However, there are times, it seems, when we sense that one child needs our love a bit more and we step up. Loving one more, doesn't, however, mean loving the other(s) less. I don't know if that even makes sense. Perhaps it is more a case of living in ~ or responding to ~ the moment.
    I look at the difference in characters such as Anna and Edith. Anna strongly declares she is not a victim. Edith lives her life, it seems, as being one.
    I am so sad that there are just a few more episodes this season.

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    1. Chris...your comment "Loving one more, doesn't, however, mean loving the other(s) less." is exactly the way I feel about my two sons. Thank you for saying exactly what I have been trying to say :)

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  19. I guessed that Edith was pregnant but did it actually say it in the letter? I even watched a second time and still could not see the letter well -- I guess we can surmise she is. My mind can bring me to all sorts of angles on the story lines so it will be interesting to see. I loved the restaurant scene and how loving Bates was to Anna and trying to make it a good evening, he was so tender. Lady Grantham sure gave a nod to those of us who have lost things recently and assumed the worst.

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  20. Well first off it is much better to get to this later in my day so I can see everyone else's take on things. I think I agree with most. I have a little to say about loving all children equally as it is something with 4 children I have given some thought too. And the answer for me, is YES I love all of my children with the same kind of unconditional love that only a mother can. But at the same time I have VERY different relationships with all of my kids as they are all VERY different individuals. Some of my kids are soo like me it seems I might "like" them more as we hang out and talk more often, and of course with only 1 girl out of the 4 it would be hard to have my relationship with her compared, especially as she is sooo like me,....but love them more, there is no way. I agree with the others too who mentioned that some kids are just more needy than others. But again, does not mean I love them more. And now that I have gotten off onto a tangent, let me talk about this weeks show. I am with some of the others. I am WAY over Edith's poor me attitude. Mary does not treat her very well, but she is too much the victim for me. As for Mary, I would love to see her with Evelyn, though I definitely don't really like that name for a man. I loved the scene in the nursery too where true love is discussed. It was tender and sweet. But probably my favorite scene of this one was when Isobel is put in her place by the Dowager Countess. I know she is contrary and uppity, but I find her hilarious. And as for Rose, I just can't get into her much. I agree with the gal that said she could ride off into the sunset to never be seen again, and it wouldn't bother me. I am curious how Edith's situation will be handled, as in those days this was no doubt a HUGE scandal, and one that you didn't get out of very easily. Loved Cora at the restaurant, but for some reason I am NOT looking forward at all to Bates getting revenge, and Anna in a long depression. Wish they had left this whole story line out. Guess that's it for now. This is fun Vee, and I am glad you are doing it. Hope your day was good.

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  21. I liked when they were in the restaurant and Cora came to their rescue.
    I don't think we can love each child exactly the same because each requires something different. I know I have always gotten along with one of my kids better. But I love them both dearly. Even if one of them won't talk to me. : (

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  22. I agree with Debbie, I love all my children the same but definitely have different relationships with all six, which makes it seem sometimes I love one more than the other. It works both ways. One must look at their feelings toward us to make sure it does not come off as more love when it is actually better relations. I said some where Bates is definitely gonna blow sometime.

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  23. I do like this show but I missed some of it and will have to catch up.
    Merle.........

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  24. Oh yes...I loved the restaurant scene and that Cora intervened on the Bates' behalf. I love all my children but I think I love them differently because they are different from each other. I'm pulling for Mr. Blake!

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  25. I feel sorry for Edith. Her own prickliness seems to prevent others from loving her as she desires to be loved. I'm also irritated with her feeling sorry for herself so often. That also makes it difficult for others to like, if not love her.
    I'm so glad Cheryl said what she did. I, too, cannot imagine loving one of my children more than another. However, there are times when I like one more, enjoy one more, ache for one more, or pray for one more. I do know families where preferences are clearly made and I find it so damaging to the children who are not the favorite.
    The nursery scene was just lovely with those two darling children and a glimpse into the hearts of those who have loved and lost.
    Cora in the restaurant - brilliant. At last. She's seemed to be a bit of a ditz at times, it was nice to see her step up to the plate.

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  26. BTW, is anyone else struck by the physical similarity between Sir Anthony Strallan played by Robert Bathurst and Michael Gregson played by Charles Edwards? Is Lady Edith attracted to a certain type? Dou you think this was done on purpose? I want better things for Edith. She has come a long way.

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    1. Why, now that you mention it! I'll see if I can find comparison photos. I've got the letter to put in, too.

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    2. Haha. Well, maybe, if Gregson were his great nephew or something. But some little tiny thing was said in the last episode that led me to believe that Gregson isn't all we thought he was. Or that maybe he was more than we thought he was. I can't wait to find out!

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  27. So much packed into one episode...and yet it felt as though it ended almost before it started. My favorite scene was where Cora intervened at the restaurant. I am not sure we can love all our children equally...but I try. Each one is so different from the other...and some seem to need a little more loving.

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  28. --this was a funny coinkydink--Elizabeth McGovern(cora) was in a movie called :"ragtime" and another movie "Once upon a time in america' that takes place partially around a lot of ragtime music. I am too old to remember all this. I love the nursery time that Tom, Isabel, Mary shared and loved when Tom told Isabel he now loved his family.

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  29. I agree with Judy that some children need more loving than others and therefore it may seem that one child is the favorite. I know I've been told that I love one child more than the other--and it was by both of my children at different times in their lives..lol...so yes, it's true but not meant to be in nay way a measure of how I love them both. Same with my grandchildren. It was a lovely scene in the nursery and I think it signals that all three were at a point in theri mourning that they now feel they can move on towards the future and a future love. I do see the foreshadowing of a romance between Mary and either Blake and Napier--time will tell! Edith's situation is the most dramatic of all this season--I hope it has a good story end!

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Thank you!

DB