Thursday, February 20, 2014

Downton Abbey Discussion

Downton Abbey, Season 4, Episode 8, 69 wonderful minutes ☺

If you haven't had the chance to watch or don't wish to be spoiled, please close the door quietly on your way out. 
~~~


The future of Downton Abbey rests with "the kids" Edith, Mary, and Tom, those pigs, and probably with the farmer Mr. Drew there as well. Great foreshadowing here. And that's all I'll say about that this week.



I had really hoped that Daisy and Alfred would get together, but he's leaving both Ivy and Daisy as friends. In the end, neither would have him. Ivy says that she doesn't want to be tied down since she doesn't know what the future has in store causing Mrs. Patmore to exclaim, "You're an optimistic generation." 

Daisy says, "I loved you, Alfred — it's time for you to go your way and me go mine. Friends forever." 

Wasn't the advice that Mr. Mason(Daisy's father-in-law) gave her wonderful? Someone ought to write it down! Okay, talked me into it:
There won't be too many people you love like this in your life and he is one. You need to say goodbye without anything jagged between you. 
And that moment between Mrs. Patmore and Daisy...precious. 

But these are the little stories compared to the others. The biggest one will be whether Bates killed Green by pushing him in front of a bus, but more on that later.

The one with the longest repercussions for Downton Abbey and the Crawley family will be the story of Edith and her baby.



What did you think of the story that Edith and Aunt Rosamund came up with? Clever what? Hahahahahha... They'll be heading off to Switzerland to learn French. Talk about adding a bit of levity. To Edith's credit, she would like to keep the child with her in Great Britain to be raised locally; she's not sure that a Swiss upbringing would be right. Her grandmother objects saying that Switzerland has everything to offer except conversation

So much to discuss here, but I'll leave some for you to pick up! I do have to hand it to Violet for being perceptive and facing the facts head on. It's more than we can say for poor Cora who goes blithely on unaware with a "Golly, life's full of surprises!"



Did you love the collective noun for a group of suitors? A Desire of Suitors? And there is much ongoing interest in Mary's group of three thus far: Charles Blake, Evelyn Napier, and Lord Gillingham. Is Fellowes pointing to Blake who seems to be quite handy with little George? 



Which is more than we can say for Great-Grandmama Violet who beats a hasty retreat when crying George arrives. The first photo shows Violet calmly discussing the Tea Pot Dome Scandal with Isobel, but don't require her to be with infants.


Back to a lesser, side story that is building...Moseley and Baxter's developing friendship. Lovely dialogue between them — "I know what it's like to feel fragile. We don't care much about Barrow below stairs, but give us credit for making up our minds about you." And then Moseley, our Eeyore-like Moseley, stood up to Thomas telling him not to be a bully.




Mary was very busy in this show with suitors and realizations. Discovering that Gillingham's man Mr. Green was Anna's attacker caused her to ultimately go to Gillingham (who has the strangest habit of showing up at Downton whether invited or not) and request that he let Green go. In that final photo, she has just learned from Gillingham that Green is dead.


And she was not too busy to go visit Jack Ross after Tom told her that he had seen Rose and she had not been shopping. They had a wonderful conversation. In the end, Jack will step aside like the gentleman that he is and like the mature adult that he is. Rose is still a party girl who wishes to hurt her mother and has openly said so.



Poor Anna. She went to London with Mary, which gave Bates the opportunity to request a day off saying he wished to go to York. Did he go to York or did he go to Picadilly and do in Mr. Green? It remains to be seen. Anna is very concerned. We're all very concerned.
What do you think?




Just the sweetest "well hello" lately. I am very fond of Robert and Cora and, as some of you know, feel that this marriage is the glue that truly holds Downton together. Just sayin'...
And the show ends with Mary walking off with her suitors and these three interested observers. 

So many wonderful quotes from Violet:

1. No life appears to be rewarding if you think too much about it.

***
 
2. In response to Isobel's "only me"...
That greeting betrays such a lack of self-worth.

***

3. In a conversation with Edith... All of life is a series of problems that we must try to solve. First one and then the next and then we die. 

(Or something like that. I have a similar philosophy, though I hope it's not quite as jaded. We have a series of problems, joys, too, and we get to die.) 

***

Other good ones...

If you thought a man was involved in a crime, but you thought he was in the right, would you say anything? (Mary questioning Blake)

***

If you're going to complicate your life, make it for the right reasons.
(Mary to Rose)

***

Marriage is a challenge even when everyone wants it.
(Mary to Jack)

***

I don't believe in types, I believe in people.
(Tom to Sarah Bunting)

***

Can you believe that next week is the final episode this season? It all went by so fast. Turning the floor over to you!

post signature

59 comments:

  1. i love this show......cant wait for sunday here in usa.
    will b sad when this series is over................
    I love granny
    xo creative hugs
    milissa

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  2. maybe if we get withdrawals we could have a downton challenge lol

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  3. You write the best reviews complete with favorite quotes. It was a packed episode with almost too much to comment on. But overriding it all is some underlying darkness about the Bates story. It would be tough to have this a remaining mystery until next year but I fear that might be so. I loved how it ended with the three looking at Mary--what a great camera shot and you caught it well. There are actually several new budding romances aren't there.

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  4. Goodness Vee, there's so much going on! I really don't think (am I being hopeful?) that Bates killed Mr. Green. Surely they wouldn't put us through another trial again? I'm hoping that Edith will be able to keep the baby. Violet surely figured that story out, didn't she? You forgot to mention the flowers that were sent for Isobel to Violet's. Do you think Violet is trying to set Isobel up with a love interest? Oh why does the series have to end so soon?? xo
    p.s. Yea to Mr. Moseley in standing up to Barrow, the bully!!

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    1. I wondered that, too. Did Violet set all this up to put Isobel together with this gentleman? She sure had some funny expressions on her face....oh, and I think it just might work! I'm impressed with Moseley this week, too!

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    2. I thought that Isobel was shocked at the way Lord Merton and Isobel were getting on, especially in light of the fact that she finds him "insufferable."

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    3. Vee, I saw it that way also. The Violet was just surprised he would send flowers to Isobel!

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    4. I loved when Violet kept looking forth and back at the 2 bouquets of flowers. It looked as if she was trying to decide who received the bigger bunch!!

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  5. I'm in a tizzy over the final episode! And I hate to say it, (because I have rooted for this couple from the start) but I don't like the way Mr Bates talks to Anna, at all.

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  6. Hmm..I have a thought on Bates/and the late wicked fellow, Mr. Green. I will keep it to myself..though..it does disconcern me, somewhat. I did not watch it as I got involved with Hawaii Life (or whatever it is called, like House Hunters), but I did read about it. I love Mosley, Violet & Isobel..hmm..you would of thunk it (like that word thunk?) Thomas would of learned his lesson already..not liking the Rose character at all. I am sure to watch Sundays episode. Blessings

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  7. I have given a lot of thought to what Tom said about not believing in types. I'm guilty of stereotyping people and this gave me pause! Very good...we could have a discussion just on Tom's revelations! You've included my favorite scenes....when Robert comes back and kisses Cora. The look in their eyes is true love. And the very ending when the three ladies bend forward....perfection! I still love seeing those babies when they come into a room. So very sweet....a little loud for Violet....but so very sweet! I just want to pick them up for hugs...American type hugs! I put a link on my blog again this morning so we can all join you for the fun! Sweet hugs!

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    1. I agree, Diane...those few words spoke volumes to me...now if only I can remember to always put them into practice!

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    2. I like that his comment put her in her place as she obviously has her 'views' on the wealthy and titled. But, yes we all need to keep an open mind.

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  8. I love this show. My sister sent me Season 1 on DVD as I missed that season.

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  9. Cranberry MorningFebruary 20, 2014 at 9:01 AM
    Oh yes, I'm sure Bates finished off the horrid Mr. Green. The Dowager Countess has so much wisdom and is so sharp. Cora, unfortunately, represents Americans as being totally clueless but pretty. Interesting, Mr. Fellowes. Cousin Isobel is a thorn in even my flesh, Violet. Such an annoying woman. I want Tom and Mary to get together, but maybe she will choose Blake. The ever-present Gillingham is just too too suffocating. Doesn't he realize he's doing just the thing that will make Mary steer clear of him????? I think the crying of the babies and the fact that Blake would presume to ask to hold the baby was more than Violet could bear. Okay, lots more thoughts on this whole thing, but I really do need to visit some of my other friends. lol Have a wonderful day, Vee. It's so much fun for us that you've provided this D.A. forum. Stop in on Friday at CranberryMorning for my own offering on the subject of Downton. A cute little surprise from a friend of mine.

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    1. http://cranberrymorning.blogspot.com/

      Oops, Judy, just a titch of a future spoiler. You have such an interesting take on the personalities of Downton.

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    2. Ohoh, I am so sorry, Vee! My problem is that I've watched each episode too many times. lol One tends to blur into the other. Glad you edited. I will miss this series when it's over. :-(

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    3. It is a challenge when one has seen Season 4 in its entirety and it has become "the whole."

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  10. This is such a great post. I love Downton. I liken it to a cup of tea and a blanket. It is always so satisfying. I'm gong to be so sad when the season is over.

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  11. I agree with others Vee, you do such a good job of wrapping up the episode complete with pictures etc. I honestly can't bear another Bates trial etc., but I do think he had something to do with Green's death. Which I am probably totally alone on this, IF he really loved Ana like he says he does, he would have left the whole thing alone! Rose is ridiculous. Can't hardly bear her either. I kind of want Mary with Tom. Violet remains my favorite. How I love to hear her deliver her hysterical lines to the others. Loved the Daisy and Alfred exchange, and you KNOW Edith's baby will be back. LOVE Mosley and that new little relationship forming. OK. guess that's it for now. Can't believe there is only 1 left! sigh,. lol Enjoy your day!

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  12. I have one comment ... the season is far too short ...

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  13. Reading through your wrap up brought me right up to speed, Vee. So many great quotes in this episode. Katie and I re wound the show to catch those 3 interested observers for the second time. That was so great!
    That first quote #1 really speaks to me. When people ask me how I am I tend to answer that I really don't want to think too much about that...how I am, as I might come up with something to grumble about. I'm so perplexed that they might not continue on with this show. So many rumors going about. I think I heard they might just do a Christmas special next season. Oye...

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  14. I just got hooked on this show this year. I hope they do a marathon on it soon so I can find out how everything got started.

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  15. First time joining in on this discussion. You do such a great job of summing up the show, Vee, I felt like I was watching it all over again. Gee, that Violet is sharp, isn't she? She continues to be my favorite character. Although Cora seems so clueless, I do love the love between herself and Lord Grantham. I agree, the Bates story is dark, and there's something about him that seems volatile and dangerous. I don't think he did it (he just got lucky that Green was in an accident, although he intended to do him in), but we may have to go through another trial. Sigh. Please spare us, Mr. Fellowes. Have not liked Moseley, but this week he did himself proud. Was so proud of little Daisy. I hope Alfred comes back for her. So much more . . . I'm going to reread your post to enjoy it all a little longer :)

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  16. There really is so much going here...not time or room to comment on all of it...here's what I am thinking though...it seems a little too obvious that Bates got rid of Mr. Green...oh, I think he had intentions to do him in but I am thinking another one of his enenies (which I am sure there are many) beat him to the punch... it's all a bit too pat....I may be wrong. I did NOT know that next Sunday is the end of the season already...WHAT??? I do NOT like Tom's new "friend" either and I love the way he put her in her place. It sure will be interesting when the baby is born and how all of that will play out!

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  17. I so enjoyed Sunday night's episode...but have no idea how they will wrap things up for the season finale. You did a fabulous summary / review. How long did that take you?

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  18. Love your summary of the episode. I'm thinking the farmer is going to come back into the Edith storyline somehow. I was a bit concerned about Cora. Did she seem a bit ditzy to anyone else? It seemed like she could barely put a complete sentence together between her gasps of delight as she planned the Carnival. Maybe, as someone else suggested, it is Fellowes telling us his thoughts of American women?? I did come away liking Mosely a bit more after this episode. Mary appears to have taken her role as an owner of Downton outside of the Abbey as she was called upon to administer to Anna's and Rose's "situations". That, along w/ her plethora of suitors, kept her quite busy! So excited for the 2 hour coming up ~~ but so sad it is the end of the season!!!!

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    1. I hate seeing the end of the season also. At first I was thinking there is nothing to replace it. Then I remembered how much I like Dickens' Bleakhouse, so I'll drag out those DVDs.

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  19. This was my favorite episode so far this season!

    Cora... ah, rose-colored Cora. She never fails to make me wonder what's in her tea.

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  20. I haven't seen this episode yet but will soon, so I just skimmed this post. The writers are very creative with new story lines. Raising pigs to save the estate! Great show.

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  21. What! The season is almost over, how can that be? I'm caught by surprise; it does seem like it only just began. All I could think of in the pigs scene is why aren't they holding handkerchiefs over their noses. The dramatics seem to have gotten more theatrical in this latest season, but there are certainly still many good lines to be enjoyed. And character development too - hooray for Moseley! I wonder if we will be told what Bates was really up to in the last episode, or will we be kept waiting till next season? Totally unrelated: I want to say that Mary's clothes are endlessly lovely and a real feast for the eyes.

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    1. Mary's clothes are so lovely and Cora wears some more 'casual' outfits that are beautiful, too. It makes me want to wear dresses. Hooray for Moseley....YES!!!

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  22. I have been waiting for season 5 lol . Have a good day !

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  23. I have to admit, I don't mind that Mr. Green was done in...although, I do hope it wasn't Mr. Bates, but actually karma stepping in. Violet is a hoot; full of adages and observances and at her age can pretty much say anything and get away with it. I do think if the shoe was on the other foot (Mary instead of Edith) facing unwed motherhood, Mary would choose to defy! That's what I love about her and find Edith weak and whiny.I hate that the 4th series is coming to an end...Alas, what will we have to look forward too:-D

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  24. What a great recap! This was a very intriguing episode.
    I didn't realize there is just one episode left for this season--noooo!!
    There is something I've been wondering about for weeks, and I hope it gets addressed in the last episode, is a scene just before Micheal disappears to Germany. Edith is with him in the office, and he asks her to sign something. She asks what it is, and he gives her a very vague explanation which she doesn't even bother to question. She just signs the document--and maybe her life away??
    Does anyone remember that episode? Poor Edith just can't catch a break with her love life!

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    1. He gave her his power of attorney.

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  25. Oh my goodness! Next week is really the last week? I just got caught up.

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  26. Hi Vee,
    I love this post. Downton Abby is just a joy to watch. The hour melts away with all the drama! Thanks for sharing...
    Betty @ My Cozy Corner

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  27. Another great discussion. Thanks for hosting these, Vee. In this episode I love the way Mary continues to mature and think of others beyond herself. Her concern for Anna and willingness to get involved in making sure that wretched Green doesn't return to Downton, her involvement with the estate - it all bodes well. Edith, well, I'll hold my tongue on that. I did love the scene with Charles and the baby. So sweet.
    Mr. Bates - dark and mysterious alright. There's more going on there than meets the eye. He's so stern and unbending. I know he can show tenderness, but he seems so legalistic. Very little grace.
    I've never really warmed to Mosely, but this episode had me liking him more. I hope that the relationship with Baxter grows into something sweet.
    Oh, there's so much in each episode to discuss. We all really need to meet in someone's living room for tea together. I'll volunteer my home!

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    1. Oh I love your invitation and wish so much we lived closer!!
      Some day hopefully dear Lorrie!
      Mary

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  28. Loving this season too, does anyone know when season 5 starts (date)? What a great idea Vee, you do an amazing job hosting this discussion. Really enjoy reading everyone's comments, I have little to add, everyone has already read my mind and said it!!

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  29. Vee
    It's so interesting to read everyone's different accounts of DA.
    My favorite part of the show was when Tom set the new girl in her place with the line, I don't believe in types, I believe in people. It proves that he's come to love the family and see them for who they really are, and not how an outsider might perceive them. And then the fact that he felt it his duty to expose Rose, tells me that he truly considers himself part of the family. I do, however, wish Isobel would mind her own business and quit pushing him into attending political rallies again!
    As far as Moseley and Baxter go-Thomas is a worm and will somehow still cause trouble, only this time he'll turn his wrath on Moseley as well.. His role is to cause dissention and he will!
    Well I'm sure dreading Sunday, knowing it will be the last episode for another year...

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  30. This episode made up for all the stuff I didn't like about this season. So many charming scenes.

    I had lunch with my son today and both he and his wife watched the last episode already online (which will be the two hour episode to be shown on PBS this next Sunday). He didn't tell me much except that I'd find it interesting. I think it amusing, he was never interested in Downton before getting married to a girl who loves British dramas.

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  31. Oh, how fun to stop by and see this wonderful post! We watched this episode last night because we somehow messed up taping it Sunday night. I am not a movie or TV watcher but just LOVE this as many others do. The only thing i do not like about it is that there are far too few episodes each season!

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  32. This had to be my favorite episode this series - I was on the edge of my chair, clock watching too and wishing it would go on and on!!
    Thanks Vee for the great review as always - and all the wonderful comments I've read - our bloggin' gals are the best aren't they?

    Mary

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  33. I've never watched this show but I hear nothing but good things about it. Kinda hate I missed that train.

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  34. You sure do a great job of summarizing the show!!
    I believe that Bates did indeed kill Mr Green.

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  35. Well... that was another very good recap Vee. You could go into business doing this. I asked at the end... "do you think he did it?".. and we both looked at each other and thought that it was to obvious a script that he did..so I am hoping not.
    Have you been watching Selfrdges? We watch all the Masterpiece Theatre shows and so even though this one sadly ends.. we look forward to the new season of the next show.

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    1. I did watch that show last season, but think that I will pass this. Right. That's what I think, too. It's "too obvious" that Bates did it.

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  36. Eek - that was close - I almost read some of this but quickly scrolled to the bottom just to say hi. I WILL go back and read these discussions as soon as we have a chance to watch Season 4. The Olympics have been take our time of late.

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  37. I've watched it twice now so I can comment with a little more depth. 1st Tom Branson ( didn't I say I liked him in the last discussion). Think about how much he has changed from the brash , socialist , anti-upper crust chauffeur? That , I believe in people not types is exactly opposite the old Branson. I really loved that scene of the 3 'kids' walking in front of Downton to go look at the pigs.

    2 The clothes--The clothes are stunning in this episode. The rich dark blues and greens and then the ivory and pale pinks. We need Downton Abbey inspired clothes in the the stores merchandising people. I know it's like the drop waisted dresses of the 80's and 90's..Bring it on and the colors too..That purple Mary wears!.......Then the poor downtstairs clothes are so Black and white and muted green. Daisy's best going out outfit was still lovely , just muted shades of pale color, not the vivid colors of the Crawleys.

    3. Violet and Isobel--Violet is matchmaking -pure and simple. Pay back to Isabel for being a saint.
    4. Edith is looking lovely this season. My husband commented that they seem to be going out of their way to make her look prettier. She made a comment to Mary about Mary's taking on the business of running DA and I think it was her giving praise to Mary who snobbishly said 'we must all rise to the occasion and do our part." ..poor edith.
    6. the desire of suitors and the ladies leaning over to look at them -priceless.
    7. mary is the future of downton and so much more capable than her parents...I agree Cora seemed ditzy and everyone praised her for the bazarre when it is Mary that is holding everything together. Edith needs to ask Mary for advice on the baby.

    8. Yea Moseley! Yea Daisy!

    I truly love this show

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  38. I do not think Bates killed Mr. Green, perhaps Mr. Green spotted Mr. Bates in town and his guilty conscience caused him to try to escape and he unwittingly stepped in front of the bus. At any rate, someone on the show said that there was a crowd present and surely someone would have seen Mr. Bates push him if that was how it went. I am so looking forward to the last show this Sunday, though I'm sorry the season is at an end.

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  39. It's lovely to re-live this series of Downton through your eyes Vee. A very perceptive narrative.
    For me it's always too short - I could go on and on watching a series of that quality.
    We all seem to get so involved with the characters - that's Julian Fellowes remarkable talent.
    Have you seen the Christmas Special yet?

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  40. These discussions are sooo interesting. Thanks, Vee! Hilarious to see Violet match-making for Isobel. I love how this show causes me to research little bits of geography and history. Last week, it was the Teapot Dome Scandal - couldn't remember what that was all about. This week, I've been checking out Switzerland (particularly her borders with Germany and Austria). Wish there had been some dropped hints about Mr. Greggson (sp.?)- would love to have a tidbit to speculate on. Violet was an awesome Granny to call Edith and Rosamund on their deception, get the truth out on the table, and offer her support. I just wish Cora was in the loop (and fully functional), and even Mary, as they both*could* be robust supporters for Edith in her predicament.
    Now, about Bates. I am sure he is perfectly capable of murdering Mr. Green. The only thing that makes me think he didn't do it, is that if he said he was going to York, but went to London instead, it would be so easy to expose that lie, and that seems a rookie mistake for him to make. And yet, I still can't help but think that he is somehow responsible...does someone from prison owe him a "favor"?
    Can't wait for Sunday!

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    1. Yes, it would be nice if Cora didn't have that perpetual 'deer in the headlights' look on her face and could be a support for Edith in her time of 'trouble,' but I don't think we should expect the same of Mary. Edith has been horrid to her. I mean, remember the letter to the Turkish Embassy? Every time I see Edith I want to roll my Mary eyes and heave the Mary sigh. :-)

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  41. BTW, did anybody see Mrs. Hughes at the Church festival?? I'm thinking she gave Mr. Green the push!

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    1. Interesting thought, Susan!! I did not notice that. Hmmmmm.

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  42. I enjoy Violet's banter so much! I also have been enjoying Mary's gorgeous wardrobe of late. She always looks so beautiful--no wonder she has so many suitors.

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